Editors’ Note: This is the transcript version of the podcast. Please note that due to time and audio constraints, transcription may not be perfect. We encourage you to listen to the podcast, embedded below if you need any clarification. We hope you enjoy!
This week we are joined by Leslie Bocskor to discuss :
- Paper, Plastic & Fiber will be disrupted
- Making sense of Cannabis policy
- Why the Cannabis industry has not self-regulated
About Leslie Bocskor
Bocskor’s insights, expertise, and global stature make him the man who policy makers, investors, and entrepreneurs seek out for future planning and immediate fixing. He is the undisputed choice as the voice on cannabis issues and business, from state-of-the-art technology and best practices to policy, industry financing and expansion. Committed to a culture of compassion at Electrum Partners and throughout the industry, he takes pride in ushering in changes that rewrite history, whether it’s the empathic opening of patient access, or the invention of a national innovation funding reset button.
His far-reaching banking and entrepreneurial experience and inimitable style are bolstered with his knowledge of any cannabis vertical — from domestic and international policy to finding your niche investing opportunity, from supercritical extraction to ERP solutions, from seed-to-sale to the entourage effect of strategic business integration. Bocskor has become one of the most influential people in the cannabis space, guiding policy and reform.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesliebocskor/
#Cannabis #hemp #INQD
At Eighth Revolution (8th Rev) we provide services from capital to cannabinoid and everything in between in the cannabinoid industry.
8th Revolution Cannabinoid Playbook is an Industry-leading report covering the entire cannabis supply chain
The Dime is a top 50 Cannabis Podcast
Contact us directly at [email protected] Bryan Fields: @bryanfields24 Kellan Finney: @Kellan_Finney
[00:00:00]Bryan Fields: What’s up guys. Welcome back to the episode of the dime I’m Brian Fields. And with me as always is ke Finney. And this week we’ve got a very special guest, Leslie Butch core. Leslie, thanks for taking the time how you doing today? I’m
[00:00:11]Leslie Bocskor: doing fantastic. It’s really great to be here. It feel really great to be here on camera with you.
[00:00:15] You know, I’ve been reading, uh, what you’ve been doing and watching what you’ve been doing. And it’s just such an honor, and I, I love what you’ve been doing. Your, your fans are enormous. The, the following is great and the content
[00:00:25]Bryan Fields: is excellent. I really appreciate you seeing that.
[00:00:27]Kellan Finney: And Kelly, how are you doing?
[00:00:28] I’m doing well, just enjoying Colorado and really excited to talk to Leslie. Yeah. Leslie,
[00:00:32] for
[00:00:32]Bryan Fields: the record, where were you born? Leslie? I was
[00:00:35]Leslie Bocskor: born. I was born in New York city. That’s an east coast of France. I located now though. Um, I’m out in Las Vegas. The west coast. Yeah. Well, you know, right. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:00:45] Pacific time zone. I was born at a hospital that no longer exists. Flower fifth avenue grew up in, in and around New York city and moved out here to Vegas in 2010. Awesome.
[00:00:57]Bryan Fields: Awesome. So let’s, let’s kind of dive in a little bit [00:01:00] for our listeners that aren’t free about you. Can you give a little background about you?
[00:01:03]Leslie Bocskor: Sure. Uh, so, you know, personally, like I said, I’m from New York city. I actually spent some time growing up in Northwest, in New Jersey as well. Uh, so you know, very much an east coaster. Um, I, uh, as I said, you know, before you can take the. The boy out of the city, but you can’t take the city out of the boy.
[00:01:20] I’m always gonna be very fond of New York. I try to get back as often as I can. Um, you know, on a personal note, I’m very oriented towards, uh, a cultural endeavors and sort of, uh, values oriented projects. I’ve been the chairman and founder of a couple of arts and Phil philanthropic organizations. Uh, personally, I’m an avid attendee and have been, although not recently of burning man, my wife and I have been going since 19 together since 1998.
[00:01:47] My son went for the first time, uh, when he was just two months old, he’s also the youngest ever, um, recipient of a burning man, honorarium art grant for a project called the Jedi dog temple for kids that [00:02:00] ended up being in a burning man, uh, art show that was in the Smithsonian. Uh, I’ve been as a professionally.
[00:02:06] I started out in investment banking and finance. Uh, a number of years ago, I was one of the first investment bankers to focus on the internet. And new media as a new sector back in the mid to late nineties. Um, I have been, uh, a cannabis enthusiast. My original due diligence on cannabis goes back to when I was 15 years old.
[00:02:27] And I started smoking pot for the first time at my school bus stop prior to going to high school. And, um, so, you know, anyway, personally, I ended up coming out here to Vegas for quality of life reasons. It, it, it turns out that when I came here and I didn’t realize how awesome warm. Dry and sunny was, but it’s been fantastic.
[00:02:49] And then also I got really lucky in that. Nevada is one of the jurisdictions and probably the jurisdiction with the best regulatory framework for legalized cannabis [00:03:00] and, um, adult for medical and adult use cannabis. And then when I got out here, I just sort of switched my focus originally coming out to the, to Las Vegas, to do research on the casino and gaming industry.
[00:03:11] And when I got here, I saw that hemp and cannabis presented an opportunity that when I did my research was unlike anything I’d ever encountered in all of my previous years in finance and banking. And so I focused on it exclusively. And so here we
[00:03:25]Bryan Fields: are, I’m excited to kind of dive into some of those specifics.
[00:03:28] So when you were making that transition or thinking about making that transition from that pivot from investment banking to cannabis, was there any hesitation take us through what those early days were like and what you were feeling when you were making that
[00:03:38]Leslie Bocskor: move? Okay. So, um, 2010, I come out to Vegas and I’ve been a cannabis, you know, aficianado on and off for many years, since I was 15, I stopped when I was working in finance, I stopped having anything to do with it.
[00:03:54] Not because I thought there was anything wrong with it, but just, I went through a period where I wasn’t drinking. I wasn’t smoking. I wasn’t, you know, I [00:04:00] was just not drinking coffee. I was just being super straight and narrow and focused on my career. Uh, and so when I came out here, although I wasn’t an active, consistent cannabis user, uh, I had always been very much a, you know, had an affinity for it.
[00:04:20] And so I came out here and I saw there was a medical marijuana market. Although, not a market. There was a medical marijuana law in Nevada. I went and visited some friends in San Francisco. You know, they, they showed me what was going on with dispensaries in the medical marijuana market in, in California.
[00:04:36] And I started to do some research on it, cuz I knew that if there was gonna be legal, legal adult use cannabis, it was gonna be a massive opportunity. So I started reading some research in 2010 and 11. One of a couple of reports I read were the Rand Corp and the United nation studies that were done about the illegal market, the black market for marijuana cannabis in the [00:05:00] United States.
[00:05:00] And in 2010, according to ran Corp in the UN the market for black market, uh, cannabis in the United States was between 42 and 50 billion a year. Now to give you an idea, the total value of the all professional sports, essentially the same year, major league baseball. The NFL, the NHL and the NBA was under 35 billion.
[00:05:26] So weed was bigger than sports in America. And that got me to really sort of think, and I was really digging into it. And then Colorado and Washington. Past adult use a friend of mine. Who’s a political operative, Joe BSK, who is just without him. I don’t think we would have the weed industry in the United States, the cannabis industry in the United States that we do.
[00:05:49] Uh, he said, you know, watch what happens. It’s gonna, they’re gonna pass these ballot initiatives. And I said, Joe, you’re just a hopeful stoner. It’s never gonna happen in our life lifetimes. Sure enough. They passed them exactly the way they said. [00:06:00] He said they would, I sat down with him. I said, okay, you’re right.
[00:06:03] I was wrong. Explained to me how you knew that and what’s going on. And he showed me the data and I said, oh, this is the moment. And so I UNW all of my previous projects that I was involved in and I began to focus exclusively on hemp and cannabis and what those industries would represent in the United States and beyond, and how that was going to, to roll out and how that phenomena was going to.
[00:06:28] Move throughout the world. And, uh, as a result, I got very fortunate. I got involved very deeply in the policy side, advising policy makers here in Nevada, in California, Pennsylvania, Florida, uh, Costa Rica now, Mexico and other places. And, um, I haven’t looked back. It’s been a spectacular shift. It’s uh, candidly, it’s one of the, the five best decisions of my life.
[00:06:53]Kellan Finney: Did you ever consider moving to Colorado or Oregon after they, they passed those ballot?
[00:06:58]Leslie Bocskor: So I’ve considered [00:07:00] moving to Colorado prior to my moving to Vegas, actually. So one of the, um, places that my wife and I had on our decision matrix to consider moving to was Glenwood Springs, Colorado love Glenwood.
[00:07:15] It is one of the, like talk about quality of life. One of the best places in the world
[00:07:20]Kellan Finney: I’m originally from crest Butte. So it’s just right over the
[00:07:22]Leslie Bocskor: pass. Oh, no way. Oh, dude. That is totally. Let me tell you that Colorado. Listen, I love, I love my life here in Vegas, but I gotta tell you if, uh, the, uh, you know, the opportunity presents itself.
[00:07:36] I would not be surprised if I were to start, you know, spending some time every year, uh, out at Glenwood Springs. I’ve been looking at it very seriously. Ever since we moved to Vegas. Beautiful hots Springs there. Oh my God. One of the, one of the only naturally occurring vapor waves in the world, I know, gave with a hot spring emanating in, into it in like, and as a matter of fact, it’s a famous, it was famous for, uh, doc holiday [00:08:00] that’s right.
[00:08:00] Nine days because of his being, uh, tub Cullo and it’s such an incredible place. And the energy there is amazing and the food and the environment and the, you know, activities. It’s just such a great, a great location. One of the most, one of my favorite places in the entire country
[00:08:16]Kellan Finney: and now the
[00:08:17]Leslie Bocskor: cannabis too.
[00:08:18] Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. As a matter of fact, I’m hoping to go back and visit there if not this summer, early fall of this year.
[00:08:28]Bryan Fields: So I wanna ask your hands are tied all across the industry with multiple companies. Take me through what a day to day is like for Leslie. What type of topics is, is he going through?
[00:08:38] What type of conversations are you having? And talk to us about what goes on.
[00:08:42]Leslie Bocskor: Okay. Uh, great question. So, um, the days can be very different on a day to day basis, but overall on a week to week and month to month basis, it’s pretty consistent. Our focus right now, my focus right now is one. We are [00:09:00] very interested in the moment in time that we’re in, as it regards the beginnings of the establishment of brands, that will be the brands that last for years to come in cannabis in hemp, in consumer products that cross, uh, around the entire.
[00:09:20] The spectrum. So one area is we’re very focused on brand development and where that’s going, understanding what the, who the consumers are of the various different pro product categories. Making sure we understand those discrete product categories, understanding the consumer and their need states in those product categories, understanding what they’re spending patterns will be, and then understanding what brands will, what brand type of presence will likely be able to establish a relationship with the consumers and last for time to come.
[00:09:54] So there’s a big portion of my time that’s spent on that. A another portion of my time is [00:10:00] spent on policy. What is, how is I, how will policy evolve as regards. Cannabis domestically and internationally. So meaning for example, some of the issues we look at, even though hemp is legal, there are still so many gray areas, Delta eight, Delta 10, um, there’s even someone out there that said that believes that as long as the gummies, they produce are less than 0.3% THC by weight, that they can produce THC gummies that are legal to ship across borders.
[00:10:40] Cuz technically speaking, if it’s less than 0.3% THC by weight, it’s considered hemp, it’s not considered marijuana on a federal basis. Then there is also, we’re trying to understand how does the work in process hemp extract and the fact that when people are making these different products, how does the fact that the [00:11:00] extract goes above 0.3% THC in the manufacturing process, thereby breaking.
[00:11:06] Federal law. And then that extract is now considered marijuana. So does that mean that the products that are made from that now are illegal, legal, again, gray area. How’s that going involved? What’s going to happen on the federal basis with the safe, the safe act what’s going to happen with descheduling what’s the department of justice going to do.
[00:11:27] And when and why? Um, then we’re looking at Mexico, Mexico, or, you know, three years ago, their Supreme court declared. Prohibition of cannabis on individual use and possession, and even having a market for it was illegal. And so they, for three years now have been trying to implement a regulatory framework to create a legal market there.
[00:11:49] Uh, how is that going to evolve? How will Europe evolve? Greece, Germany, Spain, Italy, um, uh, Portugal, France. How will those markets [00:12:00] evolve over time then looking at Asia, India, uh, Thailand and others, how will those markets evolve over time? So there’s a lot of time that we spend on analyzing that, um, speaking to the stakeholders in those areas and trying to really not just understand what’s going on, but where we can, how can we help on a pro bono basis?
[00:12:21] How can we write white papers? How can we provide access to real data so that in every one of these conversations, it can be a conversation of fact based. Data between sensible people. So we can start to see the beginning of real, uh, rationality in how cannabis and hemp are dealt with moving forward.
[00:12:44] Then another part of my day is spent on the enterprises that navigate these areas. And what is it that we’re going to do? What are we, you know, so again, Mexico, I’m extremely interested, not just in the Mexican market. I think [00:13:00] that the entire, um, Spanish and Portuguese speaking Mar market, the Latin X market is over 750 million people worldwide.
[00:13:09] The United States and Canada is Canada is just 360 million. So essentially. Double the size of that market is the Latin X market. And so we see that as an area that people have not been as focused on. And we’re very interested in, in what that is. And then, you know, there’s a, I’m a father. I have a, my, my son is, uh, you know, is 10 years old and I am, uh, I’m, I’m hopefully gonna be trying to make it to burning man this year with him and my wife.
[00:13:37] So when I get some free time, we talk about doing things like that. But as regards, you know, professionally. We are focused on what the changes are going to be and how they’re gonna manifest what’s going on from a policy perspective and how can we help with that? And then also, you know, I have been extremely interested in the public markets.
[00:13:55] What’s gonna happen with the public markets because we see that when we do ultimately see the United [00:14:00] States change its federal policy, that the, uh, corresponding shifts as regards to the flows of capital, the velocity of capital, the establishment of businesses, the creation of value, the creation of jobs, et cetera, is going to have a significant change as well.
[00:14:14] And so we spend a lot of time trying to understand that, prepare for it and, and be in a position to make the most of it as a, as it changes.
[00:14:21]Kellan Finney: That’s a, a ton of items that you’re kind of juggling back and forth. uh, do you, is it like scheduled out where you’re like, okay, from eight to nine, I think about policy from nine to 10, I deal with brands or is it a lot more fluid throughout the day or is it kind of like each day is kind of devoted to one of those
[00:14:37]Leslie Bocskor: topics?
[00:14:38] So it’s really fluid because this is a very entrepreneurial time, you know? And so, um, in, in the beginning of any industry, when I was there at the beginning of the, the, uh, internet and new media industry, when I’ve watched the beginning of the cryptocurrency and FinTech revolution, that’s come out of blockchain and hash draft when I’ve looked at the [00:15:00] cybersecurity industry and where we are with that, which is also another industry that is very, you know, sort of it’s, it’s big, but it’s gonna become a lot bigger PR pretty quickly.
[00:15:11] When we look at the early stages of those industries, agility and, um, flexibility. Are really the rules of the day because things move so quickly changes happen so fast that if I establish a more rigid structure for myself, I’ll miss a lot of the opportunities and I’ll find myself at odds with the environment I’m trying to navigate.
[00:15:37] So at this point, the, in, in what we’re doing, we’re very entrepreneurial. We’re very, we focus on agility. We focus on flexibility moving forward so that we can navigate this rapidly changing, super dynamic and very challenging, um, [00:16:00] environment from a. Perspective of how we can contribute as corporate citizens and as citizens in general, because we’re very value based.
[00:16:09] We wanna make sure that what we’re doing is the right thing to do, and then how we can also navigate it from an economic basis to make sure we’re making the right decisions for ourselves and our partners.
[00:16:18]Bryan Fields: They also place so nicely together, right? When you’re talking about like domestic challenges and what, what could potentially happen from a scenario standpoint that’s critical for your current day to day, but then forward looking from an international standpoint where you wanna expand even more.
[00:16:31] So for, let’s say with the future opportunity holds and then communicating with policy makers about the importance of, Hey, we need to get our stuff together because if not, we’re gonna be left out of important conversations in the us will be literally locked into the United States without having access to that global market.
[00:16:46] So while, while it is probably challenging to juggle all those, it’s probably also super critical to have a perspective on the different variables so that you can make accurate recommendations when you’re leading up your team for success in the future.
[00:16:57]Leslie Bocskor: Brian, you couldn’t be more, [00:17:00] right. Let me just make a couple of observations.
[00:17:02] I’m not gonna name any names, cuz I don’t want to throw anybody under the bus. We have seen billions of dollars just lit on fire and burned just to create warmth. There’s been no effect from so much money that’s been spent on people trying to come in and, and navigate this and make money in the cannabis and hemp industry.
[00:17:24] Why? Because this is a unique moment in business history. We have never seen anything like this before, where there’s been a prohibition of something for 80 years. That’s the size of these industries. Let’s talk for a minute about hemp. So hemp as a result of the marijuana tax act of 1937 and then the single convention treaty of narcotic drugs at the United nations in I guess what was the 63?
[00:17:54] Um, Essentially hemp was made illegal on an international basis because [00:18:00] of policy changes that the United States made internally. And so, um, those, those shifts making hemp illegal, kept it out of these three very important industries where it’s extremely important. You know, hold on a minute, let me just turn off.
[00:18:18] There’s something that keeps sending me, uh, notifications. There we go. So the three industries that hemp was left out out of that it’s now starting to come into as a disruptor are plastics, paper and fiber. So hemp was made legal during world war II, cuz it’s a great source of, of parachute material cord, all sorts of reasons.
[00:18:48] It’s such an incredibly useful plant for so many things, but in the last 80 years, a hundred years nearly. There’s been so much innovation in hydrocarbon based plastics. It’s a [00:19:00] 1.1 trillion industry. Five years ago, the global fiber industry, cotton and other fibers, 700 billion. The global paper industry, the average us consumer uses 700 pounds of paper per year, 700 pounds of paper per year.
[00:19:21] The average consumer, the global paper industry, just the top 300 companies is something like 600 billion a year. And as a regard now, Pulp paper made from trees is horribly inefficient. I mean, a lot it’s sort of generally known, uh, uh, a paper mill in a town is so toxic or so unpleasant that people that live there end up getting an odor in their bodies that emanates from their bodies, just because they’re proximity to the plant and all of the affluent and what comes out of it, the plastics industry, I mean, you [00:20:00] know, who doesn’t know about the.
[00:20:02] The garbage patch in the Pacific ocean. How many times a day do we hear stories about microplastics in our body, microplastics in our food microplastics in, in, in our, in the water where we’re finding out about plastic and not just the plastic itself and the difficulty it has in biodegrading into other components, but the things that get released like toluene and benzene and other toxins that are endocrine disruptors, carcinogens, and, and more that go into our, our, um, environment on a consistent basis from our use of plastics.
[00:20:34] How many things do we have that are made of plastic? Our phones, headphones, water bottles, everywhere. Everything is made of plastic. And these plastics are highly. Toxic to our environment, hemp based plastic, and bioplastics even Henry Ford in the forties recognize the value of it when he built a car, largely outta bioplastics that were, that was [00:21:00] that hemp was a huge component of which is why.
[00:21:03] Now automobile manufacturers are starting to do the same thing. They’re making many of their components out of hemp based plastic. Well, why is that so significant? It’s significant because when hemp biodegrades, it doesn’t create the type of problems that plastic does. Not only, it ends up becoming one of the largest carbon negative industries in the world.
[00:21:19] As we pull the carbon dioxide out of air, into the hemp plant we make plastics out of that. Carbon that’s in the plant. And then when it’s, it goes into landfill is waste. It’s essentially carbon sequestration taking the carbon oxide out of the atmosphere and putting it back in the earth in a positive way.
[00:21:35] Now, what, what does this have to do with your original question? It has to do with the fact that what we are trying to understand is how these changes will manifest in these industries. Where will those opportunities be? How do we need to understand how regulation will affect it? And how do we position ourselves first and foremost, to make the best contribution to the world around us, to add value, to do things that are [00:22:00] values based and to, in some way to reduce harm in our actions, by making the world a better place, then we, we, we, of course we wouldn’t even be looking at it.
[00:22:09] If we didn’t see that there was a way to do this, that made a lot of sense economically. And then we look at the various businesses that are going to be able to come out of that then. That’s one big part of it. HAMP and industrial uses. Then we look at consumer products that are based upon it and what we’re gonna be able to do in that area and how the regulatory market will be important to navigate and influence not to for regulatory capture for ourselves.
[00:22:32] How to make good regulation for the citizens of the jurisdictions, where the regulation exists, because when you have good regulation, you then have good business environments that have good outcomes for everyone, for the business people, for the citizens and for the policy makers that that are in the jurisdiction.
[00:22:53] So we’re super involved in that as well. And every day, our focus is on trying to, to, to [00:23:00] hone our know. To, to sharpen our knowledge, to get more data research more, and then to do what we can to one, you know, contribute to the world around us and two, to do it in a way that is going to be economically sound for us and our partners.
[00:23:17]Kellan Finney: Yeah. And I think policy is gonna be a huge, uh, factor in all of those kind of concepts, if you will. I mean, if you just look at kind of your standard cannabis operator, who’s making an extract, right? There’s a ton of waste products that could be chemical feed stocks for all of those products that you just mentioned, but there’s regulations and policies in place that prevent the sale of chemicals derived from cannabis to these major markets.
[00:23:42] And then if you look at the hemp industry, who’s able to actually. Play on an industrial scale, cuz they have federal backing or at least kind of more institutional funding, if you will. Mm-hmm, , it’s really, really challenging for those, those, uh, startup companies. If you will, to enter into one of these established a hundred year old sectors, cuz [00:24:00] in order to produce the volumes, cuz it’s gonna be high volume, low margin kind of plays there.
[00:24:04] The, the upfront capital needed and the runway required for say a hemp bioplastic plant to come online and actually become competitive isn’t it’s it’s astronomical. Right? And so I think the only way that any of those entities truly have a, a fighting chance is through
[00:24:22]Leslie Bocskor: policy. So the other thing is it, I would agree with you and I would add this knowledge of policy and influencing policy, creating good policy critical, and it will allow you to understand how to position yourself from a business perspective.
[00:24:37] And I’ll also add this, the cause of this extraordinary opportunity of these products of this plant. This feed stock being off of the market for so long, the opportunity to create innovation in technologies, how to create the plastics, how to breed the best plant [00:25:00] for plastic production, how to breed the best plant for paper, and then understanding how to create the best system and, and the best methodology there’s been for creating paper.
[00:25:13] There’s been 80 years of investment in how to create pulp paper from trees. I mean, we have invested trillions of dollars over the time, over time in how to. Get that industry efficient trillions of dollars into how to make plastics work and different types of plastics, trillions of dollars into fiber on a global basis.
[00:25:34] And now there’s an opportunity to start focusing on how to create opportunities to compete with those industries based upon access to the hemp plant. And so you can play in that even while avoiding the enormous capital outlays necessary to build plants by focusing on the IP and by focusing [00:26:00] on the innovation, that’s the place where the individual investor, the smaller, tighter, more focused team.
[00:26:08] Be involved without having to be as capitally, have as much capital behind them. What they need to do is make sure that their knowledge, their research, their due diligence is extraordinary. And the more they, more time they spend focused on that, the better they are with that, the better they’ll be positioned for being able to navigate a space where there’s gonna be much more players with a lot more money.
[00:26:36] And I’ll go back ke to my comment about billions of dollars being lit on fire and just burned. There’s been, I don’t need to say who they are. There’s been a bunch of big companies who put huge amounts of capital into the cannabis and hemp industry and all they have is writedowns. So having the money doesn’t actually necessarily mean you’re gonna have the [00:27:00] success.
[00:27:00] This is a great time in history where being smart, we’re being diligent. We’re being. Um, effective in how you navigate the environment. It’s like the age of the dinosaur on a corporate basis is coming to an end and the smaller, more agile, more nimble, more adaptable animals, corporate animals like, like into the mamals of when the age of the dinosaurs ended, being able to navigate it, end up becoming more significant.
[00:27:30] And I think that that’s the point in time that we’re at. And again, and then when you add things like crowdfunding and the sort of solo entrepreneurship that’s going on now, it really does give a path where yes, if you’re not careful, you’ll get crushed by the dinosaurs as they just stomp on you with their billions of dollars of capital and, and you know, legal teams, et cetera.
[00:27:54] If you’re smart and you focus on good, good information and innovation, [00:28:00] you can out, you can outwit and outplay them.
[00:28:02]Bryan Fields: You also need a real strong sense of, uh, resiliency because operating in this industry is far from hard, right? I would say it, it hard would be on the easier side on how to describe it. And you need to be ready to navigate, because like, as you were saying, when you first got started your, your scenario planning for variable challenges domestically and internationally, and for someone who’s new or from outside industry, that’s kind of unknown space, right?
[00:28:24] Because when you come from a CPG world, you come from a Clorox, you’re used to having the path established the rules and regulations are written for you. You know how to navigate, you know, who the players are here. You’re not really sure. And things are changing on a day to day basis. So kind of being able to navigate and be nimble is really, really critical.
[00:28:39] But I wanna challenge you one point, Leslie, I wanna ask how do we get in wide industry adoption? Right. It makes sense. I understand from a scientific standpoint, all the benefits, but how do we go from where we are today to get wider adoption for everyday consumers to wanting to make that choice to go to more of the hemp plastic versus the, the conventional current method.
[00:28:59]Leslie Bocskor: So. [00:29:00] You know, a dear friend, Joe BSK, who I mentioned brilliant, brilliant political cooperative. He has one of my favorite nuggets of wisdom as regards policy. He always says, you can count on a politician to do the right thing after you’ve removed every other choice. And so the same thing is true to a certain extent with consumers, we, as consumers tend to navigate to what’s easy.
[00:29:33] What is fast? What is a habit we aren’t even aware of the marketing and information that influences our decisions on a day to day basis. And as a result, it’s hard for consumers. To actually make those choices with their money to vote. What they, for what they think is right when there’s economic forces at play, you know, it’s [00:30:00] economically things are tough.
[00:30:01] We’re going into a recession. There’s been this divergence in, in wealth, in the United States in particular between wealthy and the not wealthy. And, and that’s all very real. So the answer to your question is it has to be driven by the entrepreneurs. The entrepreneurs have to be smart. They have to be resilient.
[00:30:22] They have to be diligent. This is a time where the opportunity is unlike anything we’ve ever seen. And if you are not incredibly diligent and spend your time really doing your homework to make sure you understand how to navigate it, if you’re not incredibly focused on the partners you work with and their quality, and the fact that you’re aligned from a cultural and values basis.
[00:30:48] It will become a problem. So the answer is how do, how to, to the question of how do we get the consumers to be able to make those right choices? It has to be driven by [00:31:00] economics. Yes, you have to do the right thing and it has to be economically feasible. So we have to get to the point where it’s cheaper to produce plastic straws with hemp plastic, where it’s cheaper to produce paper products with hemp paper, where it’s cheaper, which already it is.
[00:31:20] It’s more effective to produce fabrics based upon hemp done on cotton, less water, less affluent, easier to process it in some ways, easier to process. And so we need to make it efficient. One of my great examples of this is we all have heard of he pre. Yep. Right. So, um, I’m in Vegas. And one of the great things about being in Vegas is trade shows.
[00:31:42] There’s a trade show for everything. There’s a trade show for the yarn industry. There’s a, a trade show for the concrete and cement industry,
[00:31:49]Kellan Finney: Vegas trade show in the world, Vegas one. Yeah. Vegas one in the world is the concrete one, 135,000 at attendants or something else. Like that’s what,
[00:31:55]Leslie Bocskor: so I send, I, I can’t believe you know, that that’s incredible long story, long story.
[00:31:59] You’re like one [00:32:00] of the only people that, oh, like you guys knowing this data point as extraordinary. I mean, I’ll never forget that though. Shout
[00:32:06]Kellan Finney: Uber
[00:32:06]Bryan Fields: driver shout out to the Uber driver,
[00:32:07]Leslie Bocskor: thought it said. Oh, my God. That’s amazing. But let me tell you what’s I sent my team to go to that trade show. I’m here in Vegas so I can get into, I, I can find ways for my team to go into almost any show to help to do something.
[00:32:19] They go there and they go around and they ask all, they were ch tasked with, go speak to every single company, go find scientists, go find engineers and, and then go find executives and ask them, what’s the story with hemp pre, are you doing anything with hemp pre what do you know about hemp pre and most people didn’t know anything.
[00:32:41] There were a half a dozen or so that did. And what they said was really fascinating. Hemp creates strength is its biggest drawback, because what makes cement and concrete so usable is there were solvents and tools [00:33:00] developed to be able to get rid of excess material flash. So when somebody. Is using their equipment and there’s all sorts of dried concrete on it.
[00:33:11] You can’t let that make the machine unusable. You have to have something to get rid of it. Well, they have solvents that have been developed to specifically address that. So you can remove it without having to harm the equipment you can, you know, when you’re making something, you can make sure that it looks the way you want without excess material on it.
[00:33:27] You don’t go looking around at buildings or seeing big pieces of, of some of, of hardened materials sticking out on the side. That was wasn’t part of the original mold that just, you know, no, they have ways to get rid of it, but hemp is so durable and so tough and it hasn’t had, again, this gets back to what I said about innovation, the invention of the solvents, the, the materials to render the excess hemp Creek that is unnecessary or even.
[00:33:56] In the way to be able to get rid of it doesn’t exist yet. [00:34:00] So as soon as we have that, then hemp Creek becomes really competitive. But until that time it’s only gonna be a cottage industry. Pardon the pun, because it’s going to be focused only on people that can deal with that in a small basis. Not at, not at scale.
[00:34:16] Yeah.
[00:34:16]Kellan Finney: And I’ll actually add one point to that. There’s a really cool company. I was a big fan of called JDF. Uh, just bio fiber. They’re based up in Canada, they’re making like Lego block mold, injection Lego block, like cinder blocks. Right. But they’re made from hemp heard and, and, uh, water and, and lime, I think, but they’re doing this plastic mold injection, right.
[00:34:35] From an automated factory perspective. And what they mentioned was one of the biggest obstacles that they were trying to overcome was they have this big VA that they mix it all up. And then the, a super cool, like modern mold injection goes down and injects it into the, the Lego block. Kind of situation, but unless the factory’s running 24 7, and then they stop it, all the machinery breaks because of that exact point you just made, which was wild.
[00:34:58] They were trying to get, get over it [00:35:00] economically. And like, um, trying to find solvents that didn’t bankrupt, the, the company trying to get, get that stuff out of the, the system. So that’s,
[00:35:06]Leslie Bocskor: that’s pretty cool. It’s spot on. And you know, again, there are so many things about this plant and so many things about this as a, a phenomenon that are just unbelievably disruptive, uh, construction, um, uh, you know, just look at the, one of the largest industries in the world of consumer products is nutraceuticals and supplements.
[00:35:28] It’s gotta be approaching 400 billion a year. At this point, when I was looking at it six years ago, it was 320 billion, 360 billion a year. And again, what’s the single most disruptive aspect to it, to he implant right now, pharmaceuticals the narrative around drug discovery. Now. It’s no longer just cannabis and hemp.
[00:35:46] Now it’s gotten into psychedelics and things like that, but the entire conversation narrative around drug discovery has changed again, as a result of the disruption from this. So everything in the, in the industrial sector, fiber, [00:36:00] plastic paper, consumer products are being influenced. There’s so much that’s happening and so much changing.
[00:36:06] Again, going back to what we said, agility and adaptability and flexibility are the key to being able to navigate this and also policy,
[00:36:15]Kellan Finney: because like with the hemp construction material, you can’t go get like a, as an everyday home buyer. You can’t go buy, get a loan a first time home loan. If it’s not a, a stick.
[00:36:26] And I can’t a stick in a stick and frame structure, meaning it’s built out of lumber. Like I can’t go get a loan from the bank to build a hemp house, which then goes right back to policy in terms of that’s where it’s all starts for these kind of innovative technologies to be have wide
[00:36:41]Leslie Bocskor: adoption. It’s a great point, gets me back to one of the things that’s most interesting about, you know, there’s some really interesting, um, counties in the United States with very low populations.
[00:36:51] It’d be great to see policy in those counties, uh, lead the way because at a county level you can actually make a difference and you could [00:37:00] create new zoning regulations in those counties that would allow things to be done that way that could then be adopted by larger counties. I think that we’re gonna see that happen at some point than not, not to distant future.
[00:37:11] It just makes, again, it makes as you remove every other choice and leave only this, because it makes economic sense that’s gonna start
[00:37:20]Bryan Fields: to happen. Does it also help the environment from a, an environmental protection standpoint?
[00:37:25]Leslie Bocskor: Absolutely. I mean, the, it it’s again, can you, could you make, could you be involved in the hemp industry and have it be toxic?
[00:37:35] Absolutely. I mean, just look at the packaging problem that the legal cannabis industry has. It’s really, it’s a problem. I mean, go order a delivery and a plastic bag that’s not made out of hand. Plastic has packages that are wrapped in plastic that have plastic packages inside. It it’s like three layers of plastic packaging for [00:38:00] something that doesn’t really need it and should really be in again, hemp, plastic, and hemp paper.
[00:38:06] And even if it’s not hemp, it should just be packaged more, more intelligently. But I, you know, so the answer is, uh, yes, it can be, it is. Potentially, and really much easier to do things that are environmentally feasible and positive in these industries. It’s it still requires the intention, the diligence and the follow through to do it the right way.
[00:38:34]Kellan Finney: Yeah. Cause in like a perfect world, you would take the, the plant, right. You would process it. Any leftovers would then be used to create the packaging in, you know, so the whole plant was used to package it and deliver it in the perfect world.
[00:38:46]Leslie Bocskor: Right. exactly. Let’s you know, let’s talk about, and again, there’s so much one of the amazing things about being alive right now is as a global culture, we are entrepreneurial.
[00:38:59] We’re [00:39:00] still figuring it out around the world. Let’s take a look at the like. Day, doesn’t go by here in Vegas. When the conversation of water doesn’t come up, lake meat is at historic low levels. That’s not just water for farming in California, which is a huge part of it in Arizona. It’s not just water for Vegas, although not much for the water for Vegas comes from lake meat.
[00:39:22] Some of it does. It’s also the water for the Hoover dam for the hydroelectric plan. If that water goes below a certain level where it’s not going to the intakes for the turbines, a very large number of people are gonna lose electricity. So the conversations about drought and water are rampant. There are major cities around the world that have been facing real water shortages like, oh, uh, Chenai, India, Mexico, Mexico city.
[00:39:53] Right. And so now, and yet go look at how our bathrooms work. [00:40:00] People are using for waste. Perfectly good clean water is being flushed down the toilet. Literally when, instead of using the waste water from sinks that gets recycled into the, into the, uh, to the other waste in the home. It’s just all just getting flushed down the drain.
[00:40:21] And so we need to be more efficient in how we utilize all of our resources. And this is a great way. One of the things I’ve said, and so many other people like Emily had said, this is not just a new industry. It’s an opportunity to conduct industry in a new way so that it sets examples that other industries can follow.
[00:40:46] And we still, I, I believe that and we’re still doing it. And I think it’s, you’re going to see more and more of that.
[00:40:52]Bryan Fields: Leslie, what is a lesser known fact about hemp that would shock or surprise? 90% of the people [00:41:00] in the cannabis industry?
[00:41:02]Leslie Bocskor: Okay. Uh, so I’ll, it’s not just hemp, but I’ll, I’ll talk about it. The, the only truly legal consumer product in the United States is hemp cigarettes.
[00:41:12] Why? Because what I said earlier about wimpy working past hemp extract, when you are under the farm bill of 2018, where it’s hemp, if it’s less than 0.3% THC, everybody that’s taking that hand plant processing it through all of the different methods that are out there to process it and concentrating it down to an extract that then gets turned into C B, D C BG, CBN, C B D V.
[00:41:38] And the list goes on in that extraction process. The percentage of THC by weight goes way above 0.3%. At that point, it’s federally illegal. You and every, and, and every derivative product you’ve made from it is technically illegal. Not only like, are there issues with shipping and prostate lines because of the gray area around [00:42:00] CBD and, and other cannabinoids.
[00:42:01] But there is, I mean, clearly it’s, it’s according to attorneys that represent the FDA and other government agencies, once that happens, it’s not, it it’s in a gray area, whereas hemp cigarettes, you’re just taking a hemp flower processing and put it into a hemp cigarette and then selling it. You never get above 0.3%.
[00:42:25] So technically speaking as a consumer product that is based upon that for, for use, it’s essentially the only legal product out there. Nobody really thinks about that. Let’s do a
[00:42:36]Bryan Fields: quick rapid fire. Yeah. True or false Las Vegas will eventually become the Disneyland of cannabis.
[00:42:44]Leslie Bocskor: It already is true.
[00:42:47]Bryan Fields: Outside us country, you think will be a major disruptor for the hemp or cannabis industry,
[00:42:53]Leslie Bocskor: Mexico
[00:42:55]Bryan Fields: single favorite aspect of burning man.
[00:42:57] And are you still
[00:42:58]Leslie Bocskor: involved? [00:43:00] Uh, single favorite? Uh, the community aspect aspect, the culture and community, and I absolutely am still involved
[00:43:07]Bryan Fields: psychedelics as a medicine. Yay or nay. Absolutely.
[00:43:11]Leslie Bocskor: Yay.
[00:43:14]Bryan Fields: Do you think the media influences culture yay or. Ha
[00:43:19]Leslie Bocskor: I am a big fan of yay. I’m a big fan of Marshall McCluen and, um, uh, Doug Robertson and others.
[00:43:25] I mean, our world is we live in media. Now. Media is the world we live in. Uh, McCluen said in the book, understanding media, the media is the message and that’s the world we live in today. It is the matrix. The matrix we need to get unplugged from is the world that surrounds us, which is the media that surrounds us.
[00:43:46] And it’s all individualized to every person. What each person gets is their own specific feed of information. That’s different from the person right next to them. We are surrounded by media and it’s com and we have no [00:44:00] idea. It’s every aspect of our lives is influenced by it. Yeah. Yay. In a big way, how do we unplug, ah, go to burning man.
[00:44:10] That’s a good answer. Blue,
[00:44:11]Bryan Fields: the red, right. 15 years from now, most homes will be built using hemp.
[00:44:18]Leslie Bocskor: No. NA sadly
[00:44:21]Bryan Fields: true or false. You met your wife through cannabis sales.
[00:44:25]Leslie Bocskor: It’s true. I met her because when she was I sold her pot when that’s, how we first met. When, when we were both kids, the statues or limitations are long past.
[00:44:35] That’s why I asked,
[00:44:36]Bryan Fields: I knew the statue limitations
[00:44:37]Leslie Bocskor: past. Good. And, and, and it was due diligence.
[00:44:40]Kellan Finney: Really. I was just doing recently due, due diligence. Always. I
[00:44:42]Bryan Fields: appreciate the due diligence, true or false. We will see a collaboration with Cypress hill in the future.
[00:44:49]Leslie Bocskor: Well, I have every intention and desire to do it.
[00:44:53] And if it serves, be real, if it serves Cyprus, I am there to do to work with them. He’s a dear friend and he’s a [00:45:00] great guy. And, and, and he is the O they are the OG man. Like they got banned from Saturday night, live in the nineties for lighting up a joint before anybody was ever realistically thinking about a legal market.
[00:45:13] They were there. And so if I can do something to continue to work with them on the, and what they’ve done, I would absolutely do it in a heartbeat. He knows that they know it, the team knows it, and I’m here to do it. And I hope that we have the chance. And I think we will.
[00:45:28]Bryan Fields: What draws you into early stage disruptive trends in technology?
[00:45:32]Leslie Bocskor: Great question. I’ve asked myself that for a while and I think the answer is it’s just the way I’m wired. I, for whatever reason, I was re I got involved in computers back in 1980, you know, which was pretty early. I was just a kid and I was just fascinated by them. I got super involved in the inter inter in the internet and new media in the mid to [00:46:00] late nineties.
[00:46:00] I was involved in online games in the nineties. I was, I got, I got attracted to burning man in 19 97, 98. I went for the first time I got super interested in, um, I was writing about virtual currencies and studying money banking and gold from 2004 on, I was studying virtual currencies before there was even such a thing as a crypto currency.
[00:46:26] So when I first encountered cryptocurrencies, I was floored. That was around 2010, 2011, and I’d been speaking and writing about it. So the answer is I’m just wired that way. I’m attracted to things that are new and that represent massive change in how we’re gonna live and do business on a global scale.
[00:46:44] Uh, it’s nothing that I ever tried to, to develop. I just, it’s just how I, you know, how I came out
[00:46:51]Bryan Fields: since you’ve been in the cannabis industry, what did you get? Right. And most importantly, what did you get wrong?
[00:46:56]Leslie Bocskor: Wow, great, great, great [00:47:00] question. And one that most people don’t ask, cuz you learn more from your mistakes than you do your successes.
[00:47:06] So let’s talk about what I got wrong. First. What I got wrong.
[00:47:21] Some of my, okay, I got wrong in self-regulation. I was sure that by this time the cannabis industry and the hemp industry would’ve followed the alcohol industry after the drop of prohibition. And they would’ve realized how important self-regulation was like alcohol did within a year of the drop of prohibition.
[00:47:44] The alcohol industry had been investing a ton of money into self-regulation cuz they realized if the industry doesn’t self regulate government is gonna come in and regulate and they’re not gonna be nearly as good at it as if they self regulate won’t be as good for business. Won’t be as good for the [00:48:00] consumers.
[00:48:00] Won’t be good for anybody. Well, the, I was sure I was speaking about this in 2000. 14. I started talking about, oh, self-regulation is imminent and it’s critical. And we still haven’t been able to see it happen. And I was way off. I was certain we would have have self-regulatory bodies that would be making it easier for, for government regulators.
[00:48:23] Would’ve made a bunch of things easier and it just hasn’t happened. And I don’t know why. And there’s all sorts of, um, there’s all sorts of consequences of this. Why do you
[00:48:31]Bryan Fields: think it hasn’t happened?
[00:48:35]Leslie Bocskor: I think it has to do with, and this is another thing I, I think it has to do with the flows of capital and the, that, you know, historically capital free market, where, where there was a, a ton of loose money out there. There was like, look historically low interest rates, a lot of capital out there for many years now, [00:49:00] the cannabis industry, legal cannabis industry, and even the he legal hemp industry.
[00:49:04] Even federally legal in a federally legal industry has had a challenge as it regards getting traditional lending and access to capital because of the stigmas and because of the artifacts of prohibition. And so that’s my friend, Rick ick, the former, uh, associate editor of high times. And he always said, the artifacts of prohibition are gonna follow us for years to come.
[00:49:25] And he was right. And so the answer is it’s those artifacts of prohibition following us that have limited capital capital’s limit has then affected so much decision making, particularly around having the free capital to invest in, in the, in a self-regulatory body. So you have to have enough money in your enterprise to donate a quarter million dollars a year for a period for the bigger businesses, 10, 20, $30,000 a year for smaller [00:50:00] businesses to these.
[00:50:02] Uh, uh, self-regulatory um, ideas and nobody really wanted to write the check. And it’s not that the entrepreneurs are greedy it’s that they don’t have access to capital the way other industries do. And it affects so much of your decision making and that’s one of the things. And so I definitely got that wrong.
[00:50:21] Um, and then some of the things that I got right. Well, I, what I also got wrong. I expected that by this year we would see the descheduling of cannabis. Now I’ll claim force mature for that. I never anticipated, you know, governmental, uh, gridlock on the scale that we’ve seen, um, in the last, you know, six years.
[00:50:43] And I also didn’t anticipate a global pandemic, which greatly influenced the policy. If you could have forecasted
[00:50:50]Bryan Fields: that, my God, you could have really ,
[00:50:52]Leslie Bocskor: could’ve really changed some lives. I know would’ve been, it would’ve saved some lives and it would’ve just been made the world easier to navigate the [00:51:00] last few years it’s been challenging.
[00:51:01] So I got that wrong. What did I, you know, some of the things that I got, right, I got right. The need for self-regulation. I got right. I got right. The, um, a couple of the trends in the industry that were going to start to see the importance of brands that were going to start to see. I, I had been saying for years that, um, We need to get to micro dosing rather than macro dosing.
[00:51:25] I was saying, you know, there’s 75 milligram edibles. Yeah. There are some people out there that are gonna use those, but it’s gonna be the three milligram edibles and the five milligram edibles that are gonna be the ones that really end up being where the market is. And I’ve been predicting back, going back to 2014, I’ve predicted a couple of other things that we still haven’t seen happen, but we will see happen.
[00:51:44] So I, I think I’ll be right on blends. We’re gonna start to see in the legal cans industry, we’re gonna start to see blends hemp cigarettes. That’s something I’ve also been saying is gonna become something for a while and we’re starting to see happen now. And I think is gonna become massive for so many [00:52:00] reasons, uh, harm reduction, um, a, a natural place for people to use as an exit from the use of tobacco, uh, to eliminate addiction, to nicotine, and as a way to get some of the terpenes and cannabinoids into your body.
[00:52:12] Um, the, some of the things that I got right were, um, How policy was going to manifest on a state to state basis. And that each state was essentially creating a ring fence where it was going to be its own market. And that, that was going to favor small operators and that large operators were going to have challenges around that, which they still do.
[00:52:31] So you start to, you can still see small regional operators get very big, even while the MSOs are out there. They’re not able to really come in and shut down. The small operators, small operators can compete effectively against an MSO because they have a better understanding of how to navigate their own local, uh, regulatory framework and influence it.
[00:52:52] And so the MSOs trying to manage the regulatory framework of California and Nevada and Oregon and Washington and [00:53:00] Illinois and New Jersey and New York. I mean, that’s a, that is a catastrophic burden to try to, to, to manage at this point. And we haven’t gotten to the point where they can achieve the economies and scale.
[00:53:10] So it still is, is, uh, um, really favoring the smaller state based operator. And there’s, I mean, there’s probably a couple of other things I’ve gotten wrong and right. But those are some of the ones that I like. I appreciate
[00:53:23]Bryan Fields: you sharing that. What is one tiny nugget about you, Leslie? That the Leslie hive wouldn’t know.
[00:53:32]Leslie Bocskor: Um,
[00:53:37] great question again. Uh, probably
[00:53:44] that I played dig do I played, Thery do as a musical instrument. I started playing decades ago and I still do to this day. Amazing. I have one, I have one here in the office. There’s one over in the corner. I have one there.
[00:53:59]Bryan Fields: It’s not the, [00:54:00] since you’ve been in the Candi industry, what has been the biggest misconception about what, since you’ve been in the industry, what has been a misconception where you thought one thing and it was completely different.
[00:54:15]Leslie Bocskor: Hmm.
[00:54:19] Oh, it was my, not my learning about policy. Uh, I thought that politicians speak English and they don’t, it is English actually. I’m sorry. I thought they spoke the same language as me. Yeah, it’s English. But what the words mean from a policy perspective, the way that they make their decisions? I, I completely misunderstood it.
[00:54:42] And again, my, my Joe SME mentor and friend, it was his and, and a number of other people, Congressman BAU and others that I’ve had the, the, you know, good fortune to work with the treasurer of Nevada, Zach Kona, and the governor of Nevada, and so many other people along the way, [00:55:00] uh, that have gotten me to understand that the political environment in the United States makes the navigation of policy.
[00:55:09] Uh, So completely different from the navigation of business decisions that you would not be able to think that the same language describes both. And yet it does. So people who speak about policy will use English words, but they don’t have the same meanings in the context when they talk about them, that, that it does for business and things.
[00:55:30] A normal question,
[00:55:32]Bryan Fields: before we do predictions, we ask all of our guests, if you could sum up your experience in a main takeaway or lesson, learn to pass onto the next generation, what would it be
[00:55:45]Leslie Bocskor: slow is smooth. Smooth is fast, slow down, take your time and be diligent. And the major lesson that I’ve learned is the importance of taking your time to [00:56:00] know who you’re working with. And when they tell you who they are, believe them and, and be, and don’t and, and be completely comfortable saying. We can, we’ll be friends it’s best for us to, to look into, uh, working, working separately
[00:56:17]Bryan Fields: well said, all right, prediction time, Leslie it’s 2032, what sector or part of the world does hem impact the most
[00:56:29]Leslie Bocskor: 2032 plastics plastics.
[00:56:31] That’s gonna be like, so we’re talking about nine years from now. Yeah, it’s gonna begin. It’s gonna, so I, I say it’s gonna be paper first paper fiber, then plastics is sort of in that order or fiber paper, and then plastics, plastics will take the longest, but we’ll have the biggest impact.
[00:56:50]Kellan Finney: I think the chemical feed stock industry, right?
[00:56:53] The commodity chemical feed stock industry that, I mean, terpenes, there’s a ton of potential for terpenes to be used in [00:57:00] novel plastics. Right? I mean the amount of chemicals that come off of the. In cannabis extracts, right? There’s over 400 different chemical components in an extract. And we’re typically only selling one or two.
[00:57:12] Right? I think that the, the opportunity for the commodity chemical industry is
[00:57:18]Leslie Bocskor: massive, great call the ingredients industry. Yeah. The ingredient, massive industry for food. And for so many things, I, I think that that’s a great comment.
[00:57:29]Bryan Fields: Ellen’s done some pretty cool research. There. It is a eye opening when you see some of the numbers mm-hmm um, for me, I, I wanted plastic and, and paper also is good, but you took those off the board.
[00:57:39] So I’m gonna have to go with the housing market cuz uh, I still feel like they can make a big disruption if we can start building some houses and, and kind of get away from cutting down the trees. I think we can make a big difference. And I think the climate aspect and everyone’s screaming, climate can like, we need to help the climate.
[00:57:55] Well, what are we really doing? So if we can start by doing step ones, which seems like a, [00:58:00] an easy way to get started, you know, that would be the route that I would hope that, that we would.
[00:58:05]Leslie Bocskor: I love. I love that. And I’m still thinking about Kell’s comment about the ingredients industry. You’re the, that’s the first time I’ve heard anybody.
[00:58:12] I mean, I’ve been looking at the ingredients industry. There’s a huge ingredients company. They say that they influence a billion lives every day. Um, it’s a company out of, I think Kansas or maybe Iowa. I’m sorry, what McCormicks maybe? Uh, no, it’s a, it’s a family name and I don’t remember it’s a private business.
[00:58:30] And, uh, I remember talking to them and they were interested in, in the hem plant and the cannabis plant to start adding it to their ingredients business. And, um, That really got me thinking, because it’s such a sleeper that people would normally just go by and it’s such a huge part of how commerce exists in the world today.
[00:58:54] PE there are businesses that do nothing but make different ingredients for industry. Yeah. And that is a, [00:59:00] that’s a massive
[00:59:00]Kellan Finney: one. Yeah. That’s a, I mean like the cosmetics industry, right. That’s just, it’s insane. How big, like those,
[00:59:06]Leslie Bocskor: those feature are, who, who knew the fracking industry uses hemp, hemp, uh, uh, uh, hemp based, uh, components as an ingredient.
[00:59:14] Yep.
[00:59:16]Bryan Fields: So Leslie, for our listeners, they wanna get touched. They wanna learn more. Where can they find you?
[00:59:22]Leslie Bocskor: Uh, they can go to, um, my Twitter account, Leslie box score on Twitter. They can find, um, there is a, uh, page on. Facebook Leslie box score. They can find me Leslie box score on LinkedIn. They can go to the electron partners website and they can go obviously to the indoor harvest website, indoor harvest.com, electric partners.com.
[00:59:45] So really those places, electron partners.com, indoor harvest.com, Twitter, LinkedIn, and Facebook are the places to find me. I’m pretty easy to find.
[00:59:54]Bryan Fields: We’ll link those all up on the show notes. Thanks so much for taking the time.
[00:59:57]Leslie Bocskor: It’s this has been a great conversation. [01:00:00] I hope I have a reason to come back.
[01:00:01] Yeah, we’ll have to have you back. Sure. I really enjoyed it. This has been fantastic.
